On Sundays (which was yesterd here) I look at both the daily lectionary and the Sunday readings. I did not put up John 1:1 which was on the list for the day, as it was not the text that was discussed at church, and to keep the post under 2000 words. Perhaps I should have. For those who consider that Jesus may not be co equal, or but human, need to meditate on this. I’r add that I spent a few weeks translating and re-translating this as a project some years ago (I was doing some distance theology via Laidlaw College), and the Greek is more poetical and stronger. You cannot get away from seeing Jesus as the word, and part of God.
Moreover, the world did not receive God incarnate. This links to today;s post. When I used to read this, growing up, I thought this might mean social disapproval, but the people dying were in the hands of the godless soviets. That is the past, and the rules have shifted..
The Islamics have bought their death cult to us, and the governments collude with them by rediscovering blasphemy rules — and applying them to anyone who criticizes that religion, while giving everyone a free pass at Christianity.
So the cost of discipleship is obvious. As is our duty.
9But take care and watch yourselves closely, so as neither to forget the things that your eyes have seen nor to let them slip from your mind all the days of your life; make them known to your children and your children’s children – 10how you once stood before the Lord your God at Horeb, when the Lord said to me, ‘Assemble the people for me, and I will let them hear my words, so that they may learn to fear me as long as they live on the earth, and may teach their children to do so’; 11you approached and stood at the foot of the mountain while the mountain was blazing up to the very heavens, shrouded in dark clouds. 12Then the Lord spoke to you out of the fire. You heard the sound of words but saw no form; there was only a voice. 13He declared to you his covenant, which he charged you to observe, that is, the ten commandments; and he wrote them on two stone tablets. 14And the Lord charged me at that time to teach you statutes and ordinances for you to observe in the land that you are about to cross into and occupy.
25Now large crowds were traveling with him; and he turned and said to them, 26“Whoever comes to me and does not hate father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters, yes, and even life itself, cannot be my disciple. 27Whoever does not carry the cross and follow me cannot be my disciple. 28For which of you, intending to build a tower, does not first sit down and estimate the cost, to see whether he has enough to complete it? 29Otherwise, when he has laid a foundation and is not able to finish, all who see it will begin to ridicule him, 30saying, ‘This fellow began to build and was not able to finish.’ 31Or what king, going out to wage war against another king, will not sit down first and consider whether he is able with ten thousand to oppose the one who comes against him with twenty thousand? 32If he cannot, then, while the other is still far away, he sends a delegation and asks for the terms of peace. 33So therefore, none of you can become my disciple if you do not give up all your possessions.
34“Salt is good; but if salt has lost its taste, how can its saltiness be restored? 35It is fit neither for the soil nor for the manure pile; they throw it away. Let anyone with ears to hear listen!”
SO what is our duty, and how do these passages align themselves? Well, within the covenant the rules that applied to the old covenant are indeed useful and worthy of emulation. We should not forget the cost of our salvation. We should not forget that Christ died for us, and as those of Israel remember their redemption and being free men before Mt Horeb, so we should remember that Christ did not call us to slavery but freedom.
And therefore, we should not let anyone or anything stop us from following God. We should not let obedience to our parents stop this. If those in authority arrest not us but our children and our deeply beloved — which is a standard tool of the secular inquisition — from the Chekist to Homeland Security — we should not recuse ourselves or repent of our faith.
As the times become more evil, the cost of discipleship will be more obvious. May those who consider the church a useful political group unstop their eyes and take their blindfold off and realize that we are moving into a time of persecution, and choose.
Choose this world and this system, and meet despair, for it will end, and that end will not be pleasant.
Or choose christ, and choose not to account yourself by the rules of this society. For only this option heads to life.
john 1:1 isnt even a vague proof of trinitarianism, holy Scripture says nada about equality . . . except Christ’s own words in the Gospels (see John 5 below, “Nearness Theology”)
may i suggest re-re-translating (or, if at a total loss) even re-re-RE translating from the original Greek scrolls at the Smithsonian, that we may be made certain of your cred :O)
that is, if you can suffer a break from delves into Distance Theology with the Group at Laidlaw ahem
i am unconvinced that neither you, nor the fellows at Laidlaw College, are authorized to decide upon God’s nature (tho we agree that Jeshua is both man and God)
i.e.
“Jesus told them, “Truly, I tell all of you emphatically, the Son can do nothing on his own accord, but only what he sees the Father doing, What the Father does, the Son does likewise.”
cheers!
Um, Ray, I’m quite reformed, orthodox, and trinitarian. I’m taking the most accurate english translation I know of (the NASB, which tries to be literal) to make this point.
In the beginning…. is in the aorist tense — that is it was from then and still is from that time continuously… and that is hard to translate. The idea of Logos becoming incarnate clearly refers to the person who was seen by John — which is Jesus.
Now, I cannot do Greek text here, but… this is what John Calvin wrote about but the first verse of John, translated, naturally, from the Latin.
Argue back at Calvin, not me.
unusually, the neighbor’s female black lab was out today, already barking for triscuit biscuits before i’d exited the car
a fine five minutes of mutual admiration
a couple hours later i drove up the hills, into a mountain meadow, and parked across from a church, next to the trailhead
a long wood “corral” fence about three-feet high, composed of three horizontal levels of rounded beams, was on my left along the trail, and 30 feet ahead on the right, as i entered under the trees, 3 white-tail deer crossed the path, and casually began browsing the low brush on the other side
down the top fence-post came an orange and white cat that reminded me of your photo, esp given i’m currently composing something about twinning
i started talking to the cat, she began making the “pet me” prrrrb sound, stopping just across from me on the fencetop
i looked back to the right, and the smallest of the deer, a yearling perhaps, was walking straight towards us, about 20 feet away and steadily closing, so enraptured by the curiosity and novlety that the normal boundaries and fears were temporarily gone
the deer continued on, until the cat began to shift purchase on the top of the fence, in anticipation i guess of my attention
that awoke the deer sufficiently to reverse and trot off, and resume browsing nearby
no collar on the cat but the fur was incredible in sheen and softness, alternately striped tail, snow white chest and feet, and the rest a burnt orange that sparkled in the p.m. sun
silver turning to gold
i began petting her but she got so excited she kept slipping on the smallish round fencepost, finally jumped off to get down to serious business
we spent an intimate twenty minutes together along the path, and she followed me whenever i began to walk away, not yet having had her fill of weaving in-and-out of my arms etc
i humbly thanked God (yup out loud) for such an unmerited blessing, simple things as Scripture says
the exquisite beauty of the God’s creature, combined with such instantaneous trust and affection — in an outdoor setting with a stranger — reminded me of Zechariah’s passage about the Eternal Temple being built “not by power or might, but by my Spirit” and that Spirit of Love being fit foundation for Jeshua’s dwellingplace on Earth
i had praised the black and white kitty in your Kitty Post, but i am very glad indeed to have been shown the hastiness of my remarks, having now endured today’s painful lesson concerning inclusion and communication
my sincere apologies to Ginger Tabbies everywhere. it will not happen again
“Argue back at Calvin, not me.”
Scripture did not direct you to cleave to the words and ways of John Calvin, that is YOUR choice and the choice of your prot denominations, who have elevated themselves, and their pet theologies, over the directions and persons chosen by Father and Jeshua
way way WAY too much Prancing ‘n Churching in the last 2000 years, and way too little Spirit
and that is a BIG problem in these last hours before the appearance of beloved Christ
“to keep thee in the way, and to bring thee into the place which I have prepared. Beware of him, and obey his voice, provoke him not; for he will not pardon your transgressions: for my name is in him. (Exodus 23)
“Moses said, ‘The Lord God will raise up for you a prophet like me from your brothers. You shall listen to him in whatever he tells you. And it shall be that every soul who does not listen to that prophet shall be destroyed from the people.’ (Acts 3)
this, however, the Churches and Bible Institutes and Bible Academies and Bible Schools and Seminaries and pastors and deacons and elders and people in spiritual positions will NOT suffer to hear, much less obey
instead, you choose for yourselves, then become defensive (or worse) when the error is pointed out
leaders chosen unto yourselves, hearing unto yourselves as you wish, interpreting holy Scriputure according to your own wills and wishes, and when challenged you point to good — but NOT anointed — men . . . . men once again chosen by YOURSELVES — who reflect the ideas and willfulness of your own hearts
the Bible does NOT enjoin you to obey John Calvin (nor any of your other theologic selectees) and if Father of Jeshua had wanted you to obey John Calvin (or CS Lewis or on and on) they would have TOLD you that in Scripture
but they did NOT tell you that, instead they told you what you didnt want to hear, and thus you (and like minds) direct me to someone without authority or anointing under Christ by way of argument . . . someone you and your friends cling to, in rebellion against Scripture
i do not rely on John Calvin (or the geniuses at Laidlaw College) for spiritual instruction and guidance, but only on the Lord, his Word, and those directly authorized by Him and his Word
however, i do still like cats, ciao
What? Sincerely, and with all due respect, what?
I’ve probably shown up in the moddle of a conversation, but after reading through the comments several times, I still can’t figure out what the disagreement is. Debating the Nature and/or Person of Christ? I see a nod toward the Trinity, which is generally accurate, until someone plays around with the definition. Then, I notice the term “equal” and I cringe, because this is also subject to various interpretations. Then, I notice a vaque implication that Christ Jesus, the Son of God was somehow less than (inferior to?) God the Father, instead of obedient and faithful in all things.
For the sake of clarity, does either one of you hold that Christ was less than fully God or fully man? Is this merely a squabble over semantics, or is there really a disagreement over the nature of God, our Savior?
Short conversattion. A conversation is a metaphor, after all