I could have made this at a bunch of places today. It seems that everyone has been having catfights, standing on their own righteousness, and hurting people who should be allies.
In the end, I commented at Patri .
General comment. I like the people here, and get on OK the people Svar mentioned. Most of the time we are all fighting for the same things.
But when we get on our little holy horses it looks ugly. The only good thing one thread was that a certain person made it into a Barbie Cartoon.
None of us are holy. It is easy to hurt another (hell, I am as guilty of that as the next man) by email etc. This infighting, however, leads to us not having our brothers at our back.
As his Imperial Horror Misha I said recently.
If the government is allowed the right to force the Catholic Church to violate their own beliefs, then the government has, by precedent, the right to order you to do anything.
And now I put back on my Christian garb, although I am not a Catholic. Because this has nothing to do with Catholicism, it’s just the opening shot in a war that the liberal fascist left wants in order to squash any ideas that individuals have liberties that nobody can take from them, as long as they do not hurt others.
But I AM a Christian, and the Catholics, papist scum that they are, are my brothers and sisters. And I am not in the least bit unaware of the debt us protestants owe them for keeping the Faith alive in the dark years. But, most of all, they, like the Jews, are my brothers and sisters and always will be. Our differences are a matter of doctrine.
And one thing I DO know, no matter what your denomination might be (OK, if you’re Episcopalian, Bible Optional, you’re exempt. You’re just the hangers-on wanting to be with the cool kids without having to follow the rules. You’re morons) is that G-d is G-d and you are seriously delusional if you decide to pick a fight with Him.
Let’s get down from our tottering pedestals, and instead cover each other’s back.
We are taught to account others as better than ourselves. The thing that saddens me is that people who actually agree with each other are infighting.
Not on.
We are called to unity. Now, before we start talking areas of division between the Puritans and Papists, we need to cover each other.
If a Paleolithic neatherthal like Misha knows that, and will stand for his Catholic brother, so should we. The enemy loves our division.
Can we get our sense of humour back and cheerfully go irritate the infernal bureaux of the state instead, which indeed is part of our calling?
UPDATE
One of the reasons I read the Rott is you sometimes find examples that shame you. This is what I mean by unity, but said much better than I can, by Tallulah
My ancestor Sir Thomas Wyatt rode to London in 1554 at the head of a 4,000-man army to prevent the marriage of Bloody Mary and Phillip of Spain (this was during the era of the Roman Catholic Inquisition). When the Queen’s men captured him, he withstood days of severe torture as they tried to force him to implicate Princess Elizabeth, but he did not yield. They beheaded him at Tower Hill.
He gave his life for religious liberty and the nation he loved.
I know that even he, a Protestant martyr, would be riding into battle at the Papists’ side on this cause. We are all Christians, and Obama is a savage heathen who would thrust a dagger through the heart of CHRISTENDOM.
Deus Vult.
But gird your loins for battle, people. The government tyrants in Massachusetts tried to force the Catholic church to allow sexual deviants to adopt defenseless babies. The Church refused, and their adoption agencies were shut down.
Quare fremuerunt gentes? [Why do the heathen rage?]
“Why do the heathen so furiously rage together? and why do the people imagine a vain thing?
“The kings of the earth stand up, and the rulers take counsel together against the LORD, and against his Anointed:
“Let us break their bonds asunder, and cast away their cords from us.
“He that dwelleth in Heaven shall laugh them to scorn: the LORD shall have them in derision.
“Then shall he speak unto them in his wrath, and vex them in his sore displeasure:
“Yet have I set my King upon my holy hill of Sion.
“I will rehearse the decree; the LORD hath said unto me, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee.
“Desire of me, and I shall give thee the nations for thine inheritance, and the utmost parts of the earth for thy possession.
“Thou shalt bruise them with a rod of iron, and break them in pieces like a potter’s vessel.
“Be wise now therefore, O ye kings; be instructed, ye that are judges of the earth.
“Serve the LORD in fear, and rejoice unto him with reverence.
“Kiss the Son, lest he be angry, and so ye perish from the right way, if his wrath be kindled, yea but a little. “Blessed are all they that put their trust in him.”Psalm 2, from the Book of Common Prayer
This CHRISTIAN Episcopalian signing off (only the clergy are “Bible Optional,” most congregations endure them with some exasperation.
Tallulah is correct. I know of many believers in Anglicanism, including among the clergy.
Thanks for the linkage and the insightful commentary as well, I appreciate it 🙂
Only one thing: In order to not appear as anything other than what I am, I should like to clarify that when I refer to Catholics as “papist scum” it is as part of a long-running in-joke between my Catholic friends and I who, by the way, occasionally still try to get me to convert. Nothing truly derogatory was meant by it, even though I’ll be the first to admit that unless you happen to know me, that is far from clear.
Regarding my comment about Episcopalians, the “moron” bit was a bit harsher than I meant it. But they do annoy me. Then again, Tallulah IS very cool. Also, as with my Catholic brothers and sisters, I’d stand by the Episcopalians as well.
Bottom line, though, is that you nail it right on the head. Don’t let the enemy divide us.
Hey Mish, I knew that. I may not be a registered Rott, but I have lurked there for years.
Being a kiwi, you see, means that I enjoy some of the humour, but I am not going to pretend that I have served, and most of your community have.
Besides, I talk about papists and prots all the time.
I do not advocate in anyway personal attacks on anybody or characters and what I think of the the current pope (No ad hominem)is my rule. Debate however is welcome as by that people can find out the truth. However I do not in anyway endorse what that person is doing nor is what he is doing effective.
However I am a purist and I am of the view that doctrine must precede unity:
http://www.apologeticspress.org/APContent.aspx?category=11&article=1189
Who knows we might learn something from each other.
I am here to find out the truth.
We will argue about doctrine until Christ comes.
And, in my view, we should be. In the debate we find truth.
But I will back my brothers and sisters in Christ when they are under pressure. I will not, at that time, ask if they are a member of the “Four square gospel bible chapel” or whatever.
I do not, not, not beleive that we can artificially “unite” over issues where there is clearly held division. The church is Christs. He will heal the divisions by correcting our theology. If it is anything like the letters to the churches in Revelations 1 — 3, we will not like it.
But we need to back each other and support each other — even that Papist priest who thinks I am a Reformed heretic.
And at the moment, I see storms coming. I am no prophet, but you don’t need to be one to see that persecution is coming. It is time to support each other, or we will be split and destroyed. I will ignore my brother’s error while binding his wounds — in fact I will not ask him what he believes and just get on with binding them
And when we start fighting over who hurt whom on email and comments we are not helping. As you said, nihil ad hominem.
I have a pretty thick skin. I can have a heated debate with someone one day and be fine the next. I guess this is why I never bend over backwards to be diplomatic. It isn’t as much fun and I can’t understand why people seem to be so hyper-sensitive. Perhaps that is a character flaw I should work on.
The comment thread at CL’s was serious at first and then devolved into hilarity. I actually enjoyed trading barbs but other people saw it as a malicious cat-fight. Oh well.
I like patriactionary but they are letting the patient run the assylum. For all the talk about how superiorly rational men are I can’t help but notice that many of them are prone towards irrational prejudice and hypersensitivity.
It is also pretty clear that there are very different standards. Behavior that is tolerated by males is seen as arrogant and self-righteous by a woman. Part of the reason our blog exists is because we enjoy it. If we started trying to behave more the way that the Manosphere-Approved women do (Grerp, LGR, etc) then we wouldn’t be having as much fun and we would quickly lose interest in keeping it running.
Gabriella, you didn’t add anything off value to the Living Creaturely thread. Long after our lampooning had died down and the thread started to get back in motion to discuss the actual topic, you came in with this marvelous insight:
“Good post. As for this thread- Ya’ll are a bunch of gossips. Demonizing people you disagree with instead of giving them the benefit of the doubt seems to be very difficult for most of you. People are people and as such you will hate them some days and love them other days. I find some of the editors annoying sometimes (as I am sure they do me) but unlike you guys…we give each other the benefit of assuming good intentions or momentary weaknesses instead of just writing each other off as not worth our time.”
Which had everything to do with race-realism, Christianity, and the concept of “living creaturely”. We weren’t even demonizing anyone if you were to actually read the begginning of the thread. We were cracking jokes, but I suppose if you wre “hypersensitive” you’d feel “demonized”. I suppose you’re feeling insecure about your thug crushes? That you feel that there is something wrong about a full-grown woman with 7 kids acting in such an immature manner? I’m an 18-year old young man. I’ve got an excuse. What’s yours?
Look. You’re not fooling anyone. We all know who are. You’re that same basketcase who’d fret over her husband and who cried and brokedown when you got moohammered by Matthew.
“I like patriactionary but they are letting the patient run the assylum. For all the talk about how superiorly rational men are I can’t help but notice that many of them are prone towards irrational prejudice and hypersensitivity. ”
You just can’t let it go, huh? We don’t care about your opinions. I made that clear. You have shown that you nothing to add to the discussion at hand. When you decide to actually do so, I will take you seriously. Till then, run along now, the men are talking.
Fair warning everyone: most of you are commenting when I am either at work or asleep (the joys of living at GMT+12 hours). Any more personal comments will be redacted or deleted.
The topic is about how we avoid fighting each other. This has gone on over four blogs so far, and it won’t go on here.
I just wanted you to understand that it wasn’t my intent to stir crap up and that I don’t hold grudges. I can’t speak for anyone else at TC though.
How do we avoid fighting each other? Well, I plan on staying away from places where the commenters have contempt for me.
We both know that’s not true. You’re still holding a grudge from being moohammered. That was what started it. And it wasn’t your intent to stir crap up? How stupid do you think we are? Your entire comment was created to stir crap up; it didn’t address the original topic, it just addressed your little grievances. In fact, your first comment here was basically you whining about the meanie-heads over at Patri.
“Well, I plan on staying away from places where the commenters have contempt for me.”
So I guess that leaves TC. The only place where your “insights” are appreciated.
By “stir shit up” I meant cause major relationship rifts. I do enjoy spirited debate I just don’t like it when it results in everyone hating each other.
Matthew doesn’t like me and I don’t like him. Our personalities don’t mesh well. That isn’t the same as holding a grudge.
The fight occured at three sites, and I was careful in where I put the original post. I am aware that the guys at Patri can handle it. I was careful not to post at the other two sites (TC and CL,) because I was aware that it would be inflammatory.
But extending my rant by adding Tallulah… too long for even Patri.
We are told the peacemakers are blessed. They better be, because this is not, by any measure, fun..
Exactly. There was a reason why you knew that your post would have been better received at Patri. I think we both know the exact reason, especially with the latter site.
That being said, it’s a pointless endeavor and none of the fights involve you. So you do see how that is a little annoying, right? Mainly considering how the fights don’t involve you?
What debate? You didn’t come on to the site to debate, you came to hector and whine. Anyone can go to the damn thread and see that. There was no debate and the same goes for your co-editor Terri who lumbered over to make her trademark passive-aggressive jabs. Didn’t see her contribute to the discussion at hand either. Niether of you had anything of substance to say about the OT; you were just offended because we dared to lampoon TC.
Stop pretending that you actually came on to our site to debate. Same thing with Terri; I see through her “Proper Christian Lady” charade.
Look, you’ve been around these parts of the net several times under three different guises. Each time, you got the same reaction. Just stick to where you’re wanted and where the commenters can tolerate you.
Svar., the correct term is Banhammered. Thus says Ferdinand.
Chris, we’re not IMF; Ferd doesn’t contribute to our blog, and it’s Baahammered, because if a guy annoys us sufficiently, we’ll turn his comments to ‘Baa!’; if a woman does, we’ll turn it to ‘Moo!’, so that’s the Moohammer. We will deploy whichever, and other hammers, as we see fit.
That said, I’m personally sorry things have gotten to this state, between the various parties, and I look forward to future normalization of relations between several of the parties involved, at some point, after a necessary ‘cooling off’ period, a break from each other.
I said ‘personally’, because I am speaking only for myself in this, of course.
I do think reconciliation is possible; it has happened before. But some excess pride will have to be let go of, obviously, for that to occur.
I doubt it. I seriously doubt it. In order for that to take place, everything I said in my recent post and in my first comment in that thread would have to miraculously become untrue.
I’m not holding my breath, are you?
Besides, everyone’s fine with you. I’m the one who’s burned bridges. Shoddy, flimsy, good-for-nothing-but-a-nice-piss bridges, but bridges nevertheless; there really is no looking back for me. Oh well. These are just blogs, Will. Not real life. And on top of that, these aren’t even important sites of any real substance or value; it’s not like I got us a rebuke from TJF and Chronicles.
Yes I know you are not IMF, But I still liek the term.
Look, Chris, I don’t see why you feel the need to play reconciliator all the time. I find it kind of annoying to be honest; especially considering the fact that you felt the need to do it off of my original post. This isn’t even a fight. I’m just calling out shit when I see it. I did it on my Living Creaturely thread, I did it over at “Traditional” “Christianity”, and I did it here when Gabriella decided to make her annoying little jab at Patri and me; she just can’t seem to get over it and whines about it where ever she goes.
I stand by what I said that in that post and I also stand by what I said in the comment thread to that post. Why? Because it’s true and that’s the reason why certain commenters got their panties all bunched up; they knew it was true as well. They couldn’t refute the veracity of my statements so all they could do is mewl about how mean I am.
How do we do stop fighting each other? Simple. Separation. We stay in our separate spheres away from one another. That was what was going to happen anyway.
Because this conflict grieves me.